I recently saw someone suggesting that King of Dragon Pass should have voice acting.
We didn’t want to use voice because most text is not known ahead of time, but is full of placeholders:
After wearing the armor for a few days, <e> said that <he/she> felt quicker of step and clearer of mind.
(this is actually one of the simpler examples). It would be hard to keep this from sounding like one of those bad voicemail prompts, because it would have to be assembled out of pieces. There’s also the fact that the same text might be spoken by a male or female character, and they might be very young or very old when they spoke it. So it would be difficult to get quality results.
Plus of course there are over 640 000 words of text. That would obviously be expensive to record, but it would also make the game larger. If audio books are 160 words per minute, that’s about 67 hours of speech. Depending on compression, that might be another 800 MB to download!
And voice would make it really hard to update the game with more content, since we would have to have any new text recorded.
So while it sounds at first like a good idea, in reality it’s one of those things that’s impossible with a game of this scope.
How about (I suppose for future endeavors) something akin to what Nintendo did with Fire Emblem Awakening? If you're not familiar, basically they addressed that problem by voicing certain key scenes (with some lines or reaction noises at other points alongside unvoiced dialogue). Basically, using a little voice work for spice instead of trying to voice the entire production.
ReplyDeleteNot familiar with it.
DeleteI don’t really know what would qualify as a “key scene.” If KoDP is like an interactive novel, voiced it would be like an interactive audiobook. I don’t think you would want only the key chapter spoken, or key paragraphs. Can you give an example where it would have worked?
The opening narration, maybe hero quests (or the initial leg of the hero quest), things like the more heroic story beats like Derik and his war. I've also seen visual novels (I'm currently playing Steins Gate on Vita) that simply pepper the acting around. Main plot advancement stuff seems to have full acting. The large events. More mundane exchanges may be acted, or just the initial line of a block of text, or not at all. Voice as highlight and flavor seems to be a common and accepted middle ground in text games to the problem of volume in text-heavy games.
DeleteI'm drawing on my exposure to console games, where these work around safe the norm to save space and cost. Text-heavy RPGs, for example, often voice cut scenes and important sequences, and then use a little vocal work here and there for the rest.
So it's unrelated, but obviously there are no forums I know of to discuss the game with developers. I just attempted the Humakt the Champion heroquest to progress with the 7 quests required by Einarth and the prophecy, allocated 3 points to quests in Sacred Time, had 20 magic in reserve, and the quester was renowned in magic, heroic in combat, and very good or excellent in bargaining and custom. He was however, an Orlanth worshiper (we have had no Humakti available).
ReplyDeleteNot only did the quester fail, but he was dragged permanently off to become a thrall of Orlanth. Despite seemingly very strong odds in his favor. Failure sure, heroquests are dangerous, but to lose him without even the possibility of Resurrection? He was the only capable noble I had, you can only heroquest so often to raise leader abilities and the rest of them are reliant on the game generating leaders with strong abilities for you. With him gone this game is over.
Doesn't that seem a tad extreme? I put hours into this game, and it's finished by one failed heroquest.
Orlanth is an arsehole...
One could argue whether it’s good game design, but that certainly feels right for a Gloranthan heroquest. They are dangerous and unpredictable (and dangerous BECAUSE they are unpredictable).
DeleteAlso on a Gloranthan note: resurrection would be wrong for a Humakti quest. Those who are sworn to Humakt cannot be resurrected.
I take it you are not a fan of restoring the game from a previous year.
BTW, we have been debating setting up forums. Unfortunately the software that provides good user experience is not free, and we’re hesitant to start a monthly expense. (I do expect we will have forums in time for Six Ages.)
That is a good point about Humakti forswearing resurrection, even though it was an Orlanthi attempting the quest.
Deleteand I believe restoring the game to erase bad decisions, disaster or failure, completely destroys part of what makes this game so amazing; meaningful choices and meaningful consequences.
The failure also cost me 10 magic and promised further disaster in the weeks to come, though that is just sale in the wound really since the run is now essentially over
ReplyDeleteI absolutely love your game David, but if I had one issue with it it's too reliant on luck with leaders appearing and appearing/growing competent, and/or too little control of their development.
ReplyDeleteYou need to complete numerous lethal heroquests to win the game, and it takes a huge investment of time to make a leader strong and wise (one heroquest per 3 years to avoid even higher chance at catastrophe). This is frequently a recipe for disaster, and there's very little the player can do about it.
I hope Six Ages gives us more options to improve our leader's abilities, to prepare them for the challenges they need to overcome.
As well, I know leaders are called by their gods, but in my current game for example, dead leaders keep being replaced with Ernalda worshippers. 5 in a row, we need disicples of other followers to do these different heroquests but i'm not getting them, and apparently Orlanthi are too stubborn to even beseech one follower of a needed god to step up and offer their services for the clan good. This doesn't seem to make a whole lot of sense to me, though I am obviously not a Glorantha expert.
Haha I feel ha on leaders. My current group outside of my circle is mostly worshippers of Ernalda and Barntar. I might start sending out some poorly equipped expeditions.
DeleteWhat about voice acting only what the ring members say? When they give you an advice, that seems like it's done without placeholders.
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DeleteFewer perhaps, but not hard to find something like
Delete[regal and royal = true] The chiefs of the other clans are threatening to depose «c.title» «c» if we do not settle this dispute with the beastfolk. [345]
I see. Hm. Then what about adding background ambience to some of the scenes?
DeleteSo that, during an event that is happening on the market, you would hear 'market sounds' in the background.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WqtN-x09DO0&list=PLif0RJ6hFPsy-L0I28xJAhISAdEsGHxVi&index=2
A lot of work, i know. :9
That at least is possible, though it would need to work with the music.
DeleteI confess I am not a fan of the “some of” aspect. Why do some scenes rate but not others?
Please, please, please, pretty please...don't be swayed to include voice acting. It constantly cripples games with as much text and randomness as this, makes it harder to expand (let alone a LOT more expensive) and to many it detracts from the experience. People are ought to learn how to read, it'll do them good in life afterall.
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